New UASs - introduced in 4.3

[Ssnake]

Thanks. While there's no bug in the sense that there's an actual malfunction, clearly there's room for improvement.

[Gibsonm]

Thanks.

 

Moving on from the Bullitt to the Sprites.

 

It appears that the Attack sprites will only engage targets while the Recce sprites remain in the target zone - once the recce sprites finish their single orbit, the attack sprites seem to complete their existing circuit, break off and RTB, even with targets still displayed on the map?

 

[Ssnake]

Were these set to "attack", or to "scout and attack" mode?

[Gibsonm]

3 minutes ago, Ssnake said:

Were these set to "attack", or to "scout and attack" mode?

 

"scout and attack" since I assumed that meant you would get a mix of Scout units and Attack units, which is what was generated.

 

If I'm supposed to be using some other mix, then I'm all ears.

[Ssnake]

Scouts will always do their scouting, however inefficient at the moment. Attack Sprites will either fly only to already detected targets ("attack mode"), or scout before attacking ("scout and attack").

Since they didn't attack; were the targets moving, or stationary?

Due to the way these coaxial drones move when maneuvering, targeting moving vehicles is a rather difficult problem that we haven't solved yet.

[Gibsonm]

20 minutes ago, Ssnake said:

Scouts will always do their scouting, however inefficient at the moment. Attack Sprites will either fly only to already detected targets ("attack mode"), or scout before attacking ("scout and attack").

Since they didn't attack; were the targets moving, or stationary?

Due to the way these coaxial drones move when maneuvering, targeting moving vehicles is a rather difficult problem that we haven't solved yet.

 

Ah so "scout and attack" refers to the behaviours, not the composition of the waves.

 

The vehicles are static.

 

With the above where units have been detected should I use "attack" or stick with "scout and attack"?

 

Edited November 16, 2023 by Gibsonm

[Ssnake]

The intended procedure was that scouts get sent first, and when they spot targets, the attack drones will be launched, on to each last reported position. Once they reach the position, attack Sprites will start searching for the target in a spiral search pattern (or some approximation thereof).

The behavior shown in your last video is unexpected and warrants some deeper investigation. We shall also make the general search routine more efficient.

[Gibsonm]

I'll update the Wiki to reflect the comments about modes.

 

If its of any worth, here is the baseline Tutorial scenario, noting that it is not necessarily correct, just trying to convey the basics:

 

 

231117 UAS Range 4_379.sce

[Gibsonm]

May have a fix here (for Bullitt at least):
 

13 minutes ago, TSe419E said:

Mine was drone that was shot down so I can only tell you what was explained to me.  

 

First my drone was flying at 400m.  Once the drone is launched and given a waypoint the altitude at the waypoint can be set up to 500m.

Second in the mission editor edit the properties of the bullit "Day Resolution" to its highest setting.  3840x2160 in this case.

 

I tested it and it worked!

 

Edited April 27, 2024 by Gibsonm

[Ssnake]

Yeah, if Bullitt is supposed to autonomously attempt rammig other drones out of the sky, it needs to be able to actually recognize them (like, 8...10 pixels (squared) in size).

A wide angle lens will increase the detection zone but reduce the distance at which a drone can be identified.

If you want to detect at higher altitudes, a higher imaging sensor resolution and a narrower field of view will help.

[TSe419E]

Tried the bullit against the two big drones with no effect.

[Gibsonm]

9 minutes ago, TSe419E said:

Tried the bullit against the two big drones with no effect.

 

Yes, they don't work against the Sperwer or the S-100.

My issue with the "UAS Range" scenario was that they did nothing at all. when Red micro UAS flew over.

I've adjusted the Bullitt to 3840x2160 but I suspect it still wont work as you can't script Red to set an altitude. Needed a friendly Red player to manually set the altitude isn't going to happen in a player vs AI training scenario.

 

In fact having changed the resolution, it seems to be stuck at a flashing "TIS cooling down: (5.00)", even after 10mins of being deployed.

 

Edited April 27, 2024 by Gibsonm

[Gibsonm]

@TSe419E Perhaps if you get time you can tell me what I'm doing wrong?

 

Start the Mission

 

Jump to A-5/1/A in the "Bullitt" box

 

The Bullitt will deploy in front of you.

 

Once you are ready use Trigger 5 and wait for the mosquitos to buzz around. They are set to overfly every 5 minutes.

 

240428 UAS Range 4_379.sce

Edited April 27, 2024 by Gibsonm

[Gibsonm]

If it needs the opposing player to set a given altitude for their micro-UAS, perhaps I just cut it from the scenario and amend the Briefing accordingly?

 

[TSe419E]

I think the Bullit will only engage if a drone pretty much flies right overhead of it.  For now it might be best to take it out of the scenario.

[TSe419E]

I did have the flashing warning for a while.

[Gibsonm]

9 minutes ago, TSe419E said:

I think the Bullit will only engage if a drone pretty much flies right overhead of it.  For now it might be best to take it out of the scenario.

 

Yes, which unfortunately you can't script Red to do.
 

I had hoped you'd cracked it, but with this and the other issues (on earlier pages of this thread), I think AI controlled UAS are underdone at the moment.

So its either:

1. Wait for the swarm feature to work better.

 

2. Publish now but with the Bullitt and swarms cut away.

Thank you for looking though.

 

Edited April 27, 2024 by Gibsonm

[TSe419E]

You are most welcome.

[Ssnake]

The idea is that Bullitt defends your troops against quadcopters at relatively low altitudes - you know, the ones that dropped small mortar shells two years ago when this feature was introduced in SB Pro. And that their presence would force the opposing side to fly the drones at higher altitudes, where they might be more easily detected and shot down by other units, or at least become less accurate and therefore less deadly.

(I know that our quadcopters can't drop mortar bombs, the feature was introduced to allow you to experiment a bit and let an instructor create incidents and give his/her students some feedback.)

 

Of course the defense can work only more or less directly above your own troops, especially if you also want high flight altitudes also covered, which forces you to pick a smaller field of view. It's about trade-offs and tactical analysis in this case.

[Gibsonm]

6 hours ago, Ssnake said:

The idea is that Bullitt defends your troops against quadcopters at relatively low altitudes - you know, the ones that dropped small mortar shells two years ago when this feature was introduced in SB Pro. And that their presence would force the opposing side to fly the drones at higher altitudes, where they might be more easily detected and shot down by other units, or at least become less accurate and therefore less deadly.

(I know that our quadcopters can't drop mortar bombs, the feature was introduced to allow you to experiment a bit and let an instructor create incidents and give his/her students some feedback.)

 

Of course the defense can work only more or less directly above your own troops, especially if you also want high flight altitudes also covered, which forces you to pick a smaller field of view. It's about trade-offs and tactical analysis in this case.

 

I understand the real life employment, but its hard to run a tutorial mission showing "this is how you use it" if it relies on a human red player to fly it directly over your position at a suitable altitude.

 

I mean if that's its full scope, I'll put something like this in the Briefing / Wiki:

Bullitt:

 

An autonomous defensive system that if carried will be setup once the Infantry unit adopts a Defence tactic.

 

Operation:

 

Deploy and if the enemy flies a micro UAS directly overhead it may take off.

 

There is little point including it in a "training scenario" if there is no training to do. With the other systems you can go through and tell people "press this key, this will happen" and they can fly around and look at or blow things up.

 

With the Bullitt, apart from a description, it appears you can't easily demonstrate it in use.

 

Edited April 28, 2024 by Gibsonm

[Ssnake]

You could let the human player fly a quadcopter low over own troops and see what happens. Micro-drones have no IFF, Bullitt will attack any drone that it discovers with its image recognition. This may at least serve as a training aid to create awareness that if your own troops are equipped with drone-hunting tools, you either need to let them know about your intention to overfly them, or avoid their location and plot a suitable flight path.

[Gibsonm]

11 minutes ago, Ssnake said:

You could let the human player fly a quadcopter low over own troops and see what happens. Micro-drones have no IFF, Bullitt will attack any drone that it discovers with its image recognition. This may at least serve as a training aid to create awareness that if your own troops are equipped with drone-hunting tools, you either need to let them know about your intention to overfly them, or avoid their location and plot a suitable flight path.

 

Ah - Great idea!

[Volcano]

On 4/27/2024 at 4:49 PM, Gibsonm said:

In fact having changed the resolution, it seems to be stuck at a flashing "TIS cooling down: (5.00)", even after 10mins of being deployed.

 

Right, that was fixed later - either way you can ignore it (it doesn't affect anything other than being an annoyance).

 

Edited April 29, 2024 by Volcano

[Gibsonm]

54 minutes ago, Volcano said:

 

Right, that was fixed later - either way you can ignore it (it doesn't affect anything other than being an annoyance).

 

 

Ah so that's "cosmetic", it doesn't effect the performance?

 

When something else is finished, I'll rework this so the player:

1. Jumps to the unit with the Bullitt and watches it appear.

 

2. Jumps to another friendly unit and launches a Quadcopter to overfly the Bullitt equipped unit.

 

3. Jumps back to the original unit and ideally sees the Bullitt engage the Quadcopter.

[Volcano]

10 hours ago, Gibsonm said:

 

Ah so that's "cosmetic", it doesn't effect the performance?

 

Correct, it doesn't affect the Bullitt's performance in any way. Basically, the drone lacks TIS and the non-existent TIS sight is trying to cool down (so it never does).